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| Danny McSquare
2007-06-11 1:18:57 pm |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! This post has been removed by Derek While this is absolutely the place for constructive criticism and is appreciated to stimulate discussion, there are better ways to do so when referring to a song. Please refrain from making comments like this in the future. Thanks -Derek To summarize the post in not so flaming verbiage for any further discussion - the user is not happy with the album version of Detroit Waves and feels that it lacks the power and raw emotion of the live version from a year ago. The user requests that Matt considers rerecording this song because it is possibly his favorite song of all time (not just matt songs) and wants to be able to continue to make that statement. |
| vt_Brady2705
2007-06-12 00:29:16 am |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! hahaha |
| weddingdress
2007-06-12 02:54:11 am |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! haha, hmm! |
| derek
2007-06-12 10:25:55 am |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! I also at first thought that this song lacked something as compared to some of the live versions. However, this song has since grown on me and quickly became one of my favorites on the album (is it possible to pick just one? I doubt it). I believe that the song fits perfectly in with the rest of the album and provides a spark of emotion that gets to me every time. I often find myself skipping back to listen to multiple tracks again before continuing with the rest of the album and detroit waves more often than not is one of those songs. So often I hear the statement "why doesn't matt make a live cd" or "why are matt's CDs so much different than his live show" in a negative context. For me its the complete opposite. I find it an added bonus to be able to sit down and listen to the albums at work in their raw form and then hear the complete transformation of these songs into raw emotion at his shows, especially in Matt's vocals. |
| s0ngbird@mac.com
2007-06-12 2:24:45 pm |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! Cheers, Derek. |
| Mistermatt1984
2007-06-12 3:01:47 pm |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! I like the studio versions better than the live songs sometimes, I like detroit waves but for instance, sometimes its just nicer to listen to something more relaxed. I also like that you get added bonuses at the shows cause matt is always throwing other lines in the songs. It just makes it that much better |
| BennyC70
2007-06-12 11:37:58 pm |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! Detroit Waves studio version sounds fine to me. I mean...the only way to get that version closer to the live 'feel' is to have Matt put a bunch of screaming fans in the sound booth with him. ;-) |
| Danny McSquare
2007-06-13 00:44:38 am |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! I don't understand why people felt I was so out of line. My post was removed because it said something negative about Matt Nathanson??? redic... but more redic is that I was banned from mattnathanson.com... for no reason. There was no bad language in my original post... I mean, Matt himself uses vulgar language in his shows at times... so... Again the album version is brutal when compared to earlier live versions... I feel removing my original post takes credibility away from me, because I used specific dates to make my point... and removing it (and banning me from mattnathanson.com) only goes to discredit me and make me look like an off the wall person. This is wrong and gutless. If someone disagrees, make your counterpoint. Don't hide behind some webmaster and ban a fan from your website. My admiration for Matt Nathanson has not changed one bit. At the same time... I remember wondering why I kept hearing about fans getting upset at Matt or getting under his skin during shows. Now I don't wonder anymore... cause I was lashed out against too easily. In closing, I want to say differing opinions are healthy and natural; and to squash and discredit the holders of minority views not only hurts those people, it damages the very fabric that everyone involved holds dear. |
| anotherlongquietnight
2007-06-13 02:00:49 am |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! not sure why you were banned from the official board, but your posts over there were deleted because according to one of the site administrators, "we are not allowing threads with postings advertising advanced copies etc. posts will be asked to be edited, and when declined/ignored, they will be deleted, until 8/14." assuming you can get reinstated over there, wait until after 08.14 to post your criticism of the cd. for the record, i read your original post...all 3 postings of it and for the most part you stated your opinions, but your argument fell apart imo when you started getting whiny about matt ruining "your" song. well that and the posting of it 3(!!!) times. leave out the personal stuff and you'll do better in the credibility department. just a thought. |
| Mistermatt1984
2007-06-13 02:58:57 am |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! From what I read he was mostlikely banned because of individual PM's he sent to members who posted things in reply to his post that he didnt like. |
| derek
2007-06-13 09:02:49 am |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! Danny - We have no affiliation with mattnathanson.com here and you will not be banned from here for simply stating an opinion. In reality I'll probably never ban anyone. I also have no problem with you not liking any of Matt's songs, cds, etc... The only problem I do have though is with some of the methods you used to describe your distaste for Detroit Waves. Saying the song is disappointing or lacks emotion is one thing but saying "it blows" and "sticks out like an infected thumb" or whatever simply reflects ignorance on your part in trying to make an argument or stimulate discussion. I tried to sum up your post as best as possible to keep the discussion alive in not so vulgar terms. If you feel I have not done so please feel free to reiterate your case. Also posting the same post multiple times on mattnathanson.com, myspace and here is probably not the best way to get the attention that you want. I can tell you Matt did read your post - did you honestly expected a response?? when you insult the man's lively hood? The boys worked hard on the album and did a damn fine job of it. All - I do want to encourage free and open discussion here on all topics. Just please try to keep it in good taste. |
| ams_484
2007-06-13 12:36:51 am |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! you da man, derek. |
| houliganisle
2007-06-13 10:05:37 pm |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! I was going to comment on this. Then I read Derek's posts. Nothing left to say. Couldn't have said it better myself. |
| s0ngbird@mac.com
2007-06-13 10:10:05 pm |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! Here here. There is a vast difference between stating an opnion and being just plain rude about something. The infected thumb analogy was what really bothered me, too. |
| vt_Brady2705
2007-06-13 11:11:07 pm |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! I just found the post ridiculous because he came on here trying to lecture Matt Nathanson, a professional musician, about how his recording is "bad," and how this particular individual can fix all of the problems with it because he's "been playing guitar for a long time," and he *gasp* knew what key the song was in!!! If only Matt would sit down with him so the guy could instruct him on how to make the song better. What a virtuoso he is! That's like a kid who just learned how to use google going up and telling Bill Gates exactly how to make a better Windows OS. Get real. There's nothing the guy could tell Matt Nathanson about making music that Matt wouldn't just roll his eyes at and be like "and this is why I am a successful professional musician, and you aren't." |
| kiimmmiish
2007-06-13 11:15:36 pm |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! "Also posting the same post multiple times on mattnathanson.com, myspace and here is probably not the best way to get the attention that you want. I can tell you Matt did read your post - did you honestly expected a response?? when you insult the man's lively hood? The boys worked hard on the album and did a damn fine job of it." couldn't have said it better myself. |
| Danny McSquare
2007-06-16 6:28:21 pm |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! First, it is refreshing to know that Matt did read my post. You all can gang up on me for voicing the only negative opinion about Matt (and yes, I do admit that the multiple postings was overdoing it). But regarding the guy who trivialized my musical talent, I don't think you really understand. THE FIRS TIME I HEARD THE SONG I KNEW THE KEY! Not after looking it up online or figuring it out on guitar, I heard the first verse start, and I immediately knew it was in d minor. I don't know why it's so offensive to people that a Matt Nathanson fan might have substantial musical talent. I'm going to say this again, because my point has been twisted by many... The studio version of Detroit Waves is bad. And I actually stopped to look at that sentence again to make sure I wasn't being over the top like I was in that first rant... I'm not; it's just bad. It lacks the depth and emotion of the earlier live versions, it's not produced very well, and most important of all, Matt vocals during all three chorus's are drowned out by this awful guitar part that comes in... most people know what I'm talking about. It just doesn't fit in the song. Also for the record, I am a die-hard Matt Nathanson fan, PERIOD. I didn't just go to a show, hear Detroit Waves, and then decide to be a fan. I first saw him when he was touring with Matt Fisch, and he opened for Howie Day. That day, Matty blew Howie out of the water. I love his live show, just like every other fan. He's so funny on stage, he connects with the fans, and at times he's like a stand-up comedian, but better!. Look I love him! I really do. I've been coming to his live shows for like 5 years. I just feel that his best song could have been recorded a lot better, and all I've tried to do is articulate why I feel that way. Danny Thoughts... P.S. Derek, for your part, you've been more fair about this than most people. But you've got to admit Derek, the studio verison is in no way half as good as how he introduced that song live a year and a half ago. |
| vt_Brady2705
2007-06-16 7:00:31 pm |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! Well if that's true, then congratulations because you have a great ear for music. However, you may need a lesson in humility. Do you see why you would lose credibility by coming onto a message board, criticizing a professional musician, and then saying you have the talent to fix it? If somebody else came on the site, and was saying these things about you, that's one thing. But when you advertise your own skills to that extent, it comes off as arrogant and annoying, and leaves many people (like myself), rolling their eyes thinking you're full of it. |
| mistermatt1984
2007-06-16 8:33:10 pm |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! Agreed, the instrumental does over power his voice in the song, I dont think its bad, I think you just cant hear him singing like you would at a live show. As for the studio vs live. If you heard the studio version first and the live second, you wouldnt really critize the song as much you would just have thought he improved on it. |
| Bains
2007-06-16 9:27:14 pm |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! Matt is a perfectionist, I'm sure the song is just the way he wants it. And isn't that the point? It's his song. End. of. Story. |
| s0ngbird@mac.com
2007-06-16 11:00:56 pm |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! Ditto what Bains said; it's Matt's record, and if you don't like it his way, Danny, go record your own version. Ten bucks says Matt will sell more, though. Also, ditto the "lesson on humility" bit. Congratuations, you can recognize keys. Any high school student in AP Music Theory could also do that, and they probably wouldn't parade it around with trumpets, crepe paper streamers, and the caps lock key taped down. I have a very good friend who, after seeing Matt perform "Detroit Waves", having never heard the song before and actually never listening to Matt at all prior to the concert (which was at Irving Plaza in late October, to be precise) went back to my apartment after the show, picked up my guitar, and was playing it within 5 minutes. Did I give her a plaque? Nope. I didn't give her so much as a pat on the head and a cookie. She's incredibly talented. Awesome. Next topic. And finally, there is a difference between stating your opinion and being out and out rude. I was surprised when I heard the record version of "Come On, Get Higher" from a friend of mine who has mad connections and knows everyone and their mom, and, I'm not gonna lie, I was definitely a little let down. I have a live version I'm crazy about, I think the record version is way too mellow and lacking some of the power I imagined it would have. I, however, am not throwing a temper tantrum, just accepting that it's the way Matt intended. Get over it, and move on. The world is not ending, I promise. It's one track. Let's move on to more interesting topics now, hmm? |
| anotherlongquietnight
2007-06-17 02:20:46 am |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! QUOTE: "You all can gang up on me for voicing the only negative opinion about Matt (and yes, I do admit that the multiple postings was overdoing it)." i don't think people cared about the fact that your opinion was negative; they cared about the tone of your reply. also, people didn't gang up as much as they just didn't share your opinion. maybe that'll change when more people get the opportunity to hear 'some mad hope'. maybe it won't. for the record: 1. it's matt fish. no "c". 2. detroit waves made its debut almost two and a half years ago. |
| twolfe
2007-06-17 4:15:23 pm |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! holy shit everybody just let it go already and talk about something worth reading. you are talking yourselves in circles. |
| bains
2007-06-17 9:53:48 pm |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! I talked your mom into circles last night hahah im an idiot |
| osumarko
2007-06-17 11:21:33 pm |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! yeah, I think the album could use more cowbell. |
| derek
2007-06-18 12:45:56 am |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! "P.S. Derek, for your part, you've been more fair about this than most people. But you've got to admit Derek, the studio version is in no way half as good as how he introduced that song live a year and a half ago." There are many songs that when Matt debuts them for whatever reason have more emotion and fire than what they end up being. I can only speculate that after playing the same song over and over again day after day that some of that fire would be lost. Its also possible that this first live conception isn't how Matt intended the song to be at all. You have to understand that when he debuts a song live its a work in progress and he is trying to "test it out" and iron out the kinks. I know you have your opinion and I'm sure there are many people who agree with you but you must realize that in the end it is Matt's song. I guess I'm just trying to say that it doesn't matter who thinks what or who is "right" or not... in the end its Matt's and the final sound is going to be what he wants it to be no matter what my, your, or anyone else's opinion happens to be |
| ams_484
2007-06-18 5:43:55 pm |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! marko really knows how to bring humor to such an awkward thread =P |
| BennyC70
2007-06-23 1:57:20 pm |
+ Matt, Please Read This!!! " Its also possible that this first live conception isn't how Matt intended the song to be at all. " Very true...remember how Car Crash sounded, when they he started playing it full band (example: see The Paradise, Oct 2005 show)? It was a slick version, but now has changed greatly. I think it's actually the best part of listening to shows is to compare the 'work-in-progress' versions, to the finished product. |